V11 saddle

[Guest Beniamino Vigo]

Does anyone know about saddle changes on V11 models?

Having to change it on mine I've seen that the new one is directly supported by the mouldering of the tail body, whereas the older was resting on the tail frame through rubber parts. I don't think it would make any change in terms of steadiness but I'd like to know if anyone noted the difference.

 

 

Beniamino Vigo

Milano - Italy (yes, just few miles under Mandello)

V11 Rosso Mandello # 289

[Mike Stewart]

Hi,

 

My seat on my 2000 V11S seems like it is supported by the battery, at least by the witness marks left ontop the battery I guess it could be my weight

 

Mike

[jtucker]

My seat on my 2000 V11S seems like it is supported by the battery, at least by the witness marks left ontop the battery  I guess it could be my weight

My saddle was *really* rubbing against the battery in a couple spots... so much so, that if I would have left it alone, it looked as thought it was going to wear holes through the battery! I used a dremel to carve away some of the extra seat pan material, and now it seems to clear the battery OK.

 

Folks might want to keep an eye on theirs...

[RichMaund]

Dense closed cell foam tape works well to pad it there too. I think they all rub there.

 

Here's a picture of the two-up Lemans seat I shipped today. The new owner will have it tomorrow and we'll see how he likes it! Sorry. I just had to show it off. It was a great project!

[al_roethlisberger]

Looks great Rich... as usual

 

What I'd really like to see though, is how it looks installed. Maybe the new owner will grace us with some before and after photos!

 

al

[jrt]

Hi Al,

There's two 'kind of small' pics on my website of my V11 with Rich's seat. Gawd, my English teacher would kill me for that last sentance...

Anyhow- I replaced the seat by the time I took the pics of my bike with the mistral mufflers attached. One has the cowling on it.

 

http://plasterbath.chem.uiowa.edu/fairing.html

 

The fit is excellent. The seat is also a lot more comfortable now that Rich re-covered it. I specifically wanted to be able to put the cowling back on- as I recall, Rich can do it either way, although the 'with cowling' style is less comfortable for the passenger (wouldn't know about that part

I could post a couple of bigger pics if you're really interested.

 

Cheers,

Jason

[Guest Squashed Nose]

jrt,

 

your English teacher (along with me) would probably kill you for spelling sentence, 'sentance' as well.

 

Rich,

 

that seat is a stunner. I love the Italian flag in the middle. I thought the Corbin jobbies were nice! You're an artist. I want one. How much? How long?

 

Odd, don't you think? Since I've owned a V11 Le Mans, I've not seen another one and yet I want to customise the one I've got to make it look different from the rest!

[Guest russ]

Rich and Al,

 

I am the owner and I will be more than happy to grace the pages w/pic (and evaluation) this week! It looks awesome and I can't wait to try it out.

 

I will also be posting the Verlicchi Clips review as well.

 

Jeez, I just spent alot of money getting the LeMans just right, but still alot less than one of those German Uboats I used to ride.

[RichMaund]

I wrote a long post here earlier about my business. But it seems to have been deleted. Since admin didn't bother writing me to slap my wrist about it, here's the short version:

I have little backlog. I could build a seat next week for you. I spent most of the summer caring for my Mom while she was dying and it wiped out my business. Months later, it is just now picking back up to the old pace. So for now, I could set appointments as soon as next week.

Price for the solo or two up rebuild is $280 including overnight FedEx in the USA. That includes the custom cover just about any way you want it in my heavy marine vinyls and gel padding in the front. Out of the USA, you'll have to cover shipping costs. They can be high! The last 28 pound package I sent to the UK cost the customer about $100! (A rebuilt Lemans seat weighs about 20# packaged up.) And shipping things back out of the USA is more pricey than shipping them in. Turnaround time with an appointment is a couple days. That is why I work by appointment, so I can manage the turnaround times better. Too many of my own projects just sit around for months. I don't want customer stuff to do that!

So if you want a job scheduled, just contact me.

rmaund@pinn.net

[RichMaund]

Sorry folks. And my apologies to Admin! My long post is in another part of the forum, not here. It may be alzheimers!

That, or I am simply a drifty bastard.

The long post is here:

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...f=8&t=330&st=0&

[dlaing]

Hey Rich,

Can you offer other options?

Such as:

Block Foam.

Tips on how to shape the foam.

Shaped Block Foam.

Tips on how to uphoulster the seat.

Different coverings like, leather, smooth vinyl, textured vinyl, etc.

I suspect many of us are on a budget,overseas, or do-it-ourselfers.

Your posts are much appreciated.

[RichMaund]

It's not rocket science. I'll try to keep it concise, but you know me.

 

You first have to have an idea of how you want it shaped to fit you better.

To reshape it, you must be able to add foam and then shape it smoothly the way you want it. I use 100# density urethane foam. firm, but not too firm. I buy it wholesale in 2' X 9' X 2" blocks. Retail on a piece of this is about $60. To glue it together you need good contact cement. The DAP junk they sell in hardware stores is like corn syrup. Never hardens and will slip and let go. Useless, as are all the spray can cements. You need to use the commercial grade DAP upholstery cement. It is a laquer/urethane cement that is pre thinned to 80% solids for spraying. You can brush it on, but you'll use more than you need to and it IS very expensive. It is only available wholesale and it runs $50 for a 5 gallon can. Your local auto upholstery shop may sell you some if you bring in a clean resealable metal can to fill. I use a Sears spray gun to shoot it. I typically use up to a quart to rebuild a complicated seat like a EV. Reshaping, installing gel and top foam all use up the glue. I seal the seams of the cover with it as well. 45 psi will shoot it very well.

 

That covers gluing. How about shaping? I use a long bi-metal fine tooth hacksaw blade for rough shaping. Allow for removing another 1/4" when you smooth sand it later. I hear electric carving knives work too. But I keep it simple. Smooth sanding involves a high speed pneumatic disk sander. I use a 8" 80 grit disk at 90 psi pressure. Let it spin fast and take light cuts. With some practice and a good eye for evenness, you can make it look molded. The high speed sander does impart a static charge to the foam though. Makes the dust cling to you. This work generates alot of dust. It's a bloody mess and should be done outdoors. I wear coveralls and a full face respirator. I don't like paper hoods as they always seem to be in my way as I work. So I use a old Soviet surplus M70 respirator made in Bulgaria. Any of the old Soviet "helmet" syle respirators will work well as dust masks and keep all the crap out of your scalp. But I like the M70 because the tissot tube design keeps it fog free w/o needing anti-fog treatments on the lens and the lens fit flat to your face like good goggles. Very good straight ahead vision. Periphrial vision isn't important in this work. Other common masks like the GP5 have angled lenses that leave a halo effect right in front of your face where you need to see best and the filter hangs down and can get in your way as you work. The M70 has a left side mount filter. Stays out of the way. Cheap too. About $20 for a new one on the surplus market. Just make sure you buy a large! (Size 4) Most of what's for sale are smalls. I don't like the masks with the large plastic face shields. They are usually badly molded and offer poor depth perception. As you lean over to work your sweat pools in the shield and annoys you badly. My old Gulf War issue MCU/2P was like this. Sweat gets blown out the bottoms of the Soviet masks. In this case, I think they had the better design. I can't stress keeping the foam dust out of your eyes and lungs enough! Get a snoot full of that stuff and you will be wretching! So just use the sander to smooth everything just so. You can use compressed air to clean yourself off afterwards. Cotton poly coveralls shed the dust pretty well afterwards too.

 

OK, now you've shaped it! Best thing to do now is go ride. Make sure it's what you want to ride on! Changing it at this stage is child's play.

 

Got it right? Good! Next problem.... the lines of glue where you joined the layers of foam will show through the cover eventually. What to do? Buy some automotive headliner material from your local auto upholstery shop. Spray a light coating of the cement on the seat and the fabric side of the headliner. Let it tack up and lay it atop the seat. Smooth it over the sides. Where it needs to fold up, like at corners, let it. Trim the folded areas off first and then the excess off the sides. Nice and clean looking now! That 3/16" foam layer will smooth over the glue lines and gives the seams in the cover a place to sink into for a better fit.

 

I have discussed my gel installions here elsewhere. I can't give away all my secrets. But if you use gel, blend it to the cushion. Isolate the gel from the foam with 1 mil. plastic sheeting. Foam and vinyl can leech silicones from the gel in time when they are in direct contact. It pooches out the foam and will puff up the vinyl. So use plastic sheet to keep the gel out of contact with the other seat materials. You can often buy preshaped vacuum wrapped gel pads. Many folks use these. Just route a hole in the foam and lay it in. But you prolly won't cover the whole area you need to. And the edge where foam meets gel can form a pressure point you'll feel later. This is why I like my technique better. I buy bulk orders of 18" X 16" X 1/2" gel sheets. I can sell you one if you want to play with it. They are pricey though. Most expensive material I use. You want to cover the gel with a soft layer of 1/2" thick 20# foam to act as a insulative layer. Slows down the rate of heat transfer between you and t he gel to keep from cooking or freezing your butt. I will soon have a sample of a new closed cell foam here to experiment with. It seems to have the same properties as the gell with easier installation and slightly less cost. If after I test it out and like it, I'll discuss it here.

 

Now you're ready to cover it! Congrats! Probably quite a project so far! Using a fine tip marker, run a centerline down the seat on the foam. Next mark where you want the seams to be. Keep them away from where your thighs go over the seat. They form a pressure point. Keep in mind the fabric has to be able to bend to where you place the seams. Now you have a pattern of where the parts of the cover need to be. Cut a pice of vinyl oversize and lay it atop the seat. Allow for a couple inches to go under for stapling. You'll trim the excess off after you're done. Use the marker to place dots every inch or so on the underside of the vinyl where you need to sew. Allow for where you may want it tighter/looser as you do this. (I can't tell you everything folks. Some stuff takes practice to get a feel for it.) Now you can connect the dots and you have your sew line. Trim it off allowing about 5/16" excess outside the sew line. Once you have the pieces the way you want them, I recommend holding them back up to the seat to see how they'll fit, you're ready to sew.

 

Sewing: You need a heavy duty walking foot machine to do it right. Many home machines will handle two layers of vinyl. I have a old Singer that will handle three layers if I slowly roll the machine through by hand. But a walking foot machine is best. Pfaff and Juki/Consew (Old Singer designs) are my fav's. I have a Juki with large bobbin and reverse. It'll sew thru 1/4" belt leather and not drop a stitch! I use heavy 32 oz. marine grade vinyls. They stay pretty supple at low temperatures and wear very well. Better than leather. Leather is overrated as upholstery. It stretches, sags and dries out quickly if not kept treated. And trying to sit on treated upholstery grade leather is like sitting on a teflon fry pan. You'll slide off as you hit the brakes! I use heavy 138# poly sail makers thread. But nylon auto thread is adequate. But the heavy poly is stronger, more fade resistant and lasts longer.

I like to join side pieces in the middle first. Then I sew the front piece (under your butt) to it's sides. Do the same for the rear portion. Sew the rear portion to the front and then the nose piece to the front to finish it. After you sew a seam you can fold the material under and double stitch it. You can trim excess material. But don't trim too closely as you can ruin the double stitching. You have to plan the seaming in advance. Being able to think upside down and backwards is very helpful to place it all the way you want it! Visualization is everything here!

 

Ready to fit the cover? First coat the backs of the seams with urethane cement. Seals them and glues the thread to the fabric to keep a broken stitch from spreading. Allow it to dry a half hour or so. If your seat has concave depressions and you need to glue the fabric to the foam in these areas, apply glue to the foam and cover there too.

 

Now you have a half hour to kill. Get a cuppa, get on the computer and check the forum for new postings! Is this a great job or what?

 

You can buy a horribly expensive upholstery steamer to heat the covers to make them more supple for fitting. I just use a big old kerocene blower heater. Start the heater up and warm the cover a few feet away from it. When it is warm to the touch and drapes nicely, it's ready to fit. Place it on the seat so the nose fits well and it's aligned down the center. I like to warm and pull the nose snug first, then the rear and the sides back and forth to keep it all even. You must keep warm it to get the proper tension. You don't want it to sag in the sun, but now so tight that it looks like a cheap face lift. I use a pneumatic staple gun. 1/2" crown 3/8" long staples. The air guns shoot the staple thru a extended nozzle. Very helpful to place staples into tight areas on seat pans. Hand held guns lack this and they are difficult to use to place staples accurately while you're trying to hold the cover where you need it.

When you're all done, inspect it. If good, trim off the excess vinyl underneath.

 

You folks are lucky I was up before dawn today to see the meteor shower! Or I never would have had time to do this. Hope you enjoyed it. I have to get some work done. Dyno reports on the PCIII Later!

[RichMaund]

Folks

No dyno runs today to report. Sorry. The Dealer had a tech call in sick

today leaving them strapped. I'll have to go back Thursday morning.

But after over 100 miles of use, here's what I can say. Try as I might, I

cannot make it ping anymore under acceleration. No matter how many times I

get off the freeway and do a sudden hard stop to see if I can make the

engine stall, it doesn't happen. Roll on power in the 4's is much better

now. I doubt I'll ever downshift to pass anymore.

I'll see Thursday what the dyno has to say. But for now, I can say that

drivability is 100%. No more occasional glitches. This bike just plain runs

great!

[dlaing]

Thanks Rich!

Wow that's alot of work!

I kind of like the idea of shaping it myself, but to do it right, you should be equipped.

Great tips!

I once made my own leather seat cover out of an old jacket. It took about 12 hours to sew by hand! I than made a vinyl cover, to cover the leather one.(about 10 hours) I was impressed that I got them both to fit so well. With more practice they would have looked perfect. But it does take a while to sew by hand.

The reshaping I have done has been a little lumpy, because I used a razor and not the power sanding technique that you use.

I think I better order a seat from you....

[Guest russ]

Got the seat from Rich today! It is beautiful! Almost too pretty to put on the bike. Will do so when I get home from work but just looking (and touching) I can tell it will be excellent.

 

Pic and riding impression to follow tonite or tomorrow.

 

Thanks Rich!