ECU

[motoguzznix]

I applied a better picture . should work now.

 

Ernst

[dlaing]

Cool info! That peak of leaness between 5000 and 6000 rpm is where my bike pings.(and I don't give WOT at 3000RPM enough to know if it pings there)

Ernst, is your bike all stock mufflers, intake, etc.?

[luhbo]

....

This is at full throttle. The very lean condition at 3000 ist accompanied by pinging when accelerating the hot engine at WOT. I would be interested, why Moto Guzzi applied a mapping like this. ....

67036[/snapback]

 

I'm not sure wether it's really a problem of mapping. I mean WOT at 3000! Is the air fast enough to transport the gas into the cylinder? Do the valves close fast enough to keep it inside?

Lambda probes can not detect wether the gas is missing or just unburnt. They just say lean.

 

Maybe Moto's 4-gas analyzer could help here.

 

Hubert

[motoguzznix]

Lambda probes can not detect wether the gas is missing or just unburnt. They just say lean.

Hubert

When the gas is unburnt, there are residues of CO in the exhaust, which the lambda probe can detect as rich mixture.

So I think the mapping is lean in this area. But I will see how the engine responds to an enrichment at 3000 rpm.

The bike ist almost stock except my modified mufflers - see my comment in "unpacking the cans" - and a CR slightly raised to 9.6. But all that did not affect the pinging.

When I drive at a constant engine speed just below 3000 and then open the throttle to accelerate, the pinging arises immediately. More throttle more pinging. That smoothes out above 5 - 6000 rpm.

[dlaing]

I won't bore you with the part throttle measurements -

67036[/snapback]

Please try to bore us!

I am especially interested in the 3-4 degree opening rich readings.

I actually enriched my bike around that throttle opening from 2000 rpm up.

It helped cure some decelleration popping

[Admin Jaap]

Thank God, I mean Jaap, for the emoticons

On this forum you may call me Jaap

[BrianG]

Hubert

When the gas is unburnt, there are residues of CO in the exhaust, which the lambda probe can detect as rich mixture.

67147[/snapback]

 

Ernst, I think that this is incorrect............

 

The lambda sensor is an oxygen sensor. When hot (at least 250 degrees c.), the zirconium dioxide element in the sensor's tip produces a voltage that varies according to the amount of oxygen in the exhaust compared to the ambient oxygen level in the outside air. The greater the difference, the higher the sensor's output voltage.

 

CO does not figure into this reaction.

[luhbo]

Hubert

When the gas is unburnt, there are residues of CO in the exhaust, which the lambda probe can detect as rich mixture.

...

67147[/snapback]

 

I meant 'unburnt' and not 'only partially burnt'. Just remember the 'good ol' carbo days'. At least my engines, 750S LM1 and LM3, all more or less died when I completely opened the throttle at 3000. EFI works better here, but the problems with WOT and low revs are probably still the same or with bigger inlet ducts even bigger.

 

What does (quote) "and a CR slightly raised to 9.6" mean?

 

Hubert

[Cliff]

The lambda sensor is an oxygen sensor.

 

 

No it's not. It does contain an O2 sensor and in the lean mixtures operates as an oxygen sensor. In the rich environement its works in a totally different way. Can't recall the details but the buttom line is it reads CO ( indirectly) in this case.

[moto]

No it's not. It does contain an O2 sensor and in the lean mixtures operates as an oxygen sensor. In the rich environement its works in a totally different way. Can't recall the details but the buttom line is it reads CO ( indirectly)  in this case.

67188[/snapback]

More correctly, it reacts CO & H2 to make O2 when none is otherwise present. It requires a positive voltage when there is O2 present, and a negative one when there isn't. The relative amount of current that is required is related to how much O2 or CO is present.

 

Regards,

 

Derek

 

[dlaing]

EDIT I deleted this post, because it is in it entirety here:

http://www.megasquirt.info/PWC/LSU4.htm

or if lost check go here and look for article on LSU4:

http://www.megasquirt.info/

[moto]

Sorry about the long post, but this valuable article was on a domain that is now a porn site, so I here it is until Jaap's server dies without backup:

Bravo! I thought that one was gone forever...

 

Regards,

 

Derek

 

[dlaing]

Bravo! I thought that one was gone forever...

 

Regards,

 

Derek

 

67235[/snapback]

Better yet, I found the site!

http://www.megasquirt.info/PWC/LSU4.htm

not www.megasquirt2.com (porn)

[motoguzznix]

What does "and a CR slightly raised to 9.6" mean?

Stock pistons, 0,5 mm milled from the head gasket surface, 0,45 mm removed from the bottom of the cylinder to bring the pistons completely up in the bore. Stock CR was calculated to a modest 9.15!!, now I have 9.6.

Please try to bore us!

Ok, you wanted it.

I have 2 part throttle A/F measurements from my bike:

 

The rich condition at 3-4 % TP is at approx 1700 rpm in neutral at standstill. A graph does not make this clearer.

I am looking forward to change this with Ultimap.

[dlaing]

That data logger is an excellent tool!

What did you need to do to hook it up?

Weld in Bungs? hook up to coils? hook up to tps? or does it hook up to the ECU like a PCIII?

With enough runs, you should really be able to refine that map.

Thanks for posting the graphs.

It will give me a better clue about where to try enriching on my bike...or it may just be the encouragement I need to go get one.

There is some debate over how much one can fully depend on a WBO2 to determine proper llambda.

I suspect that if it reads too lean, you enrichen it, and then it reads nicely, then it is doing its job well.

Perhaps not as well as a dyno run where power is optimized, but considering all the numbers above 14:1 and below 13:1 that you can improve on, the WBO2 with data logging is worth its weight in gold.