Ignition/Starting Problems

[Guest roofer1]

Folks,

 

I have fixed/repaired the wire connection under the gas tank for the ignition switch, to have the fix only last only a week or two, then have to resort to "popping" the clutch to get the bike running....it just won't kick over using the electric start.

 

Can anyone make a suggestion, or, have had a similar experience, that will lead to a more permanent fix?

 

Thanks.....

 

Sean

[dlaing]

Welcome to the forum, Roofer!

Do you have more details?

What exactly are the symptoms?

Bike is in neutral, clutch pulled in, kickstand is up and then when you hit the starter button...then does it make a click noise, or a clicking noise? Or does the starter turn the engine slowly? Or no noise.

Does everything else work?

Be sure to check headlight, tachometer, alternator light, tail light, brake light and especially the neutral light.

Most starter problems are caused by a bad relay. (Especially on pre-2002 or so, bikes) It only has to be marginally bad to cause problems.

The second most likely culprit (IMO) is the clutch switch.

[callison]

Sounds like the clutch interlock switch to me too. With the bike not running, listen closely to the clutch handle when you engage it. If you hear a clicking every time you pull the clutch lever, your switch is fine. If not, adjust it until it clicks - it's a microswitch secured by two tiny little bolts on the clutch assembly. If you can't get it to click at all, it needs to be replaced. If it always clicks, then the connections to it under the tank on the left side may be giving problems. It has happened before, I'm sure it will happen again. You didn't specifiy which connection you had worked on - that would be helpful to the rest of this thread.

[Guest roofer1]

Welcome to the forum, Roofer!

Do you have more details?

What exactly are the symptoms?

Bike is in neutral, clutch pulled in, kickstand is up and then when you hit the starter button...then does it make a click noise, or a clicking noise? Or does the starter turn the engine slowly? Or no noise.

Does everything else work?

Be sure to check headlight, tachometer, alternator light, tail light, brake light and especially the neutral light.

Most starter problems are caused by a bad relay. (Especially on pre-2002 or so, bikes) It only has to be marginally bad to cause problems.

The second most likely culprit (IMO) is the clutch switch.

58542[/snapback]

 

Thanks for the reply + welcome....

 

Clutch switch seems fine, it clicks every time. Bike is in neutral, kick-stand up, everything ready to go....when the switch first seems "to-go" that is cut-out, if I rock the handlebars a bit back and forth, if I get lucky, it will turn over. For the most part, that does not work.

 

Sounds to me more and more like a bad relay.

 

Let me know what you think.

 

Take care,

 

Roofer1

[Guest ratchethack]

if I rock the handlebars a bit back and forth, if I get lucky, it will turn over.Let me know what you think.

Holmes would have had this one wrapped up the first time you started the bike by cycling the bars.

 

I'd say it's an extraordinarily (a favorite term of the old Sleuth's as I recall) high probability that you've still got a bad connection at the clutch switch bullet connectors under the forward-left side of your tank. Both myself and my riding Pal, LeMans Dan had the problem. We both solved it instantly and permanently by lightly re-crimping the connectors after filling with dielectric grease.

[callison]

Holmes would have had this one wrapped up the first time you started the bike by cycling the bars.

 

I'd say it's an extraordinarily (a favorite term of the old Sleuth's as I recall) high probability that you've still got a bad connection at the clutch switch bullet connectors under the forward-left side of your tank.  Both myself and my riding Pal, LeMans Dan had the problem.  We both solved it instantly and permanently by lightly re-crimping the connectors after filling with dielectric grease.

58714[/snapback]

 

What he said. Been there, done that.

[Mike Stewart]

What he said. Been there, done that.

58716[/snapback]

 

Ditto, What Carl said!

 

Mike

[dlaing]

If you hold the starter button and clutch in while moving the bars, I will agree with the others....with almost 100% certainty.

If you move the bars and then activate the clutch and starter, then my money is still on the relay....with greater than 70% certainty.

But then again, I lost at the horse track today...six freakin' dollars! I could have bought a pint of Coors with that money! (with no tip) So, I am not the best to give gambling advice.

Of course swapping relays is a piece of cake compared to removing the tank and fixing intermittent connections.

[Guest roofer1]

Holmes would have had this one wrapped up the first time you started the bike by cycling the bars.

 

I'd say it's an extraordinarily (a favorite term of the old Sleuth's as I recall) high probability that you've still got a bad connection at the clutch switch bullet connectors under the forward-left side of your tank.  Both myself and my riding Pal, LeMans Dan had the problem.  We both solved it instantly and permanently by lightly re-crimping the connectors after filling with dielectric grease.

58714[/snapback]

 

 

Sounds like a plan.....I'll give it a go.

 

Cheers

 

Roofer1

[txrider]

Ditto, What Carl said!

 

Mike

58718[/snapback]

 

Same experience here but I did a connector upgrade to eliminate possibility of a recurring problem.

[dlaing]

Of course swapping relays is a piece of cake compared to removing the tank and fixing intermittent connections.

58723[/snapback]

Yah, it is a piece of cake if you have an extra relay.

(That you can order here: http://www.dpguzzi.com/relay.htm )

If you just need to test the relay, you may be able to just pull one of the other relays and swap them.

The starter relay is the only one that needs five pins.

Some bikes are supplied with five pin relays in every socket, and some with four pin relays on all but the starter relay. If you have all five pin relays, you may interchange them.

You may want to number the relays so you can track the problem relay.

 

Since you are going the connector route first, you may wish to replace bullet connectors with these:

http://www.webbikeworld.com/Reviewed-motor...ucts/posi-lock/

Although quality waterproof connectors, such as the ones from the company, Amp, would be preferable.

If you don't want to replace the connectors, apparently the best way to restore them is not with dielectric silicone grease but with a conductive product such as this:

http://www.walkeraudio.com/sst.htm

It should be great for single bullet connections.

I would be nervous using it where it might bleed over to adjacent connectors.

[grossohc]

I have same problems with my bike, i removed the tank and checked the plug connections from the stand and they looked ok, they were joined by a plug which i thought was a bit ott and not bullet connectors so i did not want to crinp them with my pliers, anyways put tank back and it would not start till i cycled bars. my question is does the other end of the plug go to the clutch ( i forgot to look) the clutch switch clicks away so i am confident it is not that. Now with a couple of voddies in me i have just thought that actually it is a good anti theft thing. would it be better to cut of the plug and join the wires together with connectors.

[Guest roofer1]

Yah, it is a piece of cake if you have an extra relay.

(That you can order here: http://www.dpguzzi.com/relay.htm )

If you just need to test the relay, you may be able to just pull one of the other relays and swap them.

The starter relay is the only one that needs five pins.

Some bikes are supplied with five pin relays in every socket, and some with four pin relays on all but the starter relay. If you have all five pin relays, you may interchange them.

You may want to number the relays so you can track the problem relay.

 

Since you are going the connector route first,   you may wish to replace bullet connectors with these:

http://www.webbikeworld.com/Reviewed-motor...ucts/posi-lock/

Although quality waterproof connectors, such as the ones from the company, Amp, would be preferable.

If you don't want to replace the connectors, apparently the best way to restore them is not with dielectric silicone grease but with a conductive product such as this:

http://www.walkeraudio.com/sst.htm

It should be great for single bullet connections.

I would be nervous using it where it might bleed over to adjacent connectors.

58755[/snapback]

 

 

 

Thanks for all the responses.....

 

I removed tank and found the connection. It is a 5 pin bullet connection. Replacing that connection troubled me a bit....so I decided to try a temporary fix.

 

I took two small electrical tie wraps, wrapped the connection on either side, and joined the male/female sides together tight in hopes of promoting a better connection.....

 

It worked. The bike fired right up. Question? Is it fairly straight forward to replace that connection, so a more permanent fix can be put in-place.

 

Thanks.

[callison]

Thanks for all the responses.....

 

I removed tank and found the connection.  It is a 5 pin bullet connection.  Replacing that connection troubled me a bit....so I decided to try a temporary fix.

 

I took two small electrical tie wraps, wrapped the connection on either side, and joined the male/female sides together tight in hopes of promoting a better connection.....

 

It worked.  The bike fired right up.  Question? Is it fairly straight forward to replace that connection, so a more permanent fix can be put in-place.

 

Thanks.

58949[/snapback]

 

Bullet connectors are the individual type like the turn signal leads use. The multi-pin types on the Guzzi are generally Amp connectors. You pretty much have to buy a kit for the Amps as finding the exact parts for individual connectors is difficult in the USA. There are similar connectors available at places like Pep Boys if you're real handy with electrics and/or a soldering iron.

 

All is not lost though. The Amp connectors have a little rubber weather seal at the rear of the connector for each wire. Try prising them out and taking a peek down the barrel of the connector where the wire resides and see if the contact is completely seated inside the connector. Luigi may have been a little less than thorough.

[Guest roofer1]

Bullet connectors are the individual type like the turn signal leads use. The multi-pin types on the Guzzi are generally Amp connectors. You pretty much have to buy a kit for the Amps as finding the exact parts for individual connectors is difficult in the USA. There are similar connectors available at places like Pep Boys if you're real handy with electrics and/or a soldering iron.

 

All is not lost though. The Amp connectors have a little rubber weather seal at the rear of the connector for each wire. Try prising them out and taking a peek down the barrel of the connector where the wire resides and see if the contact is completely seated inside the connector. Luigi may have been a little less than thorough.

58951[/snapback]

 

I'll have to check on Luigi's craftmanship.....perhaps Lee Fong can do better....

 

Roofer1