Skeeve Posted September 10, 2005 Share Posted September 10, 2005 I wonder what became of the MGS01 Serie? That 992cc 102hp 428lb bike that is harder to find than bigfoot! Too bad really I thought that bike looks great in the brochure. I dont care what anyone says, I think Guzzi needs some sort of sports bike in their lineup. It doesnt have to be competetive with the Jap bikes i.e. the Triumph 600 sportbike isnt quite as fast but its still a good bike...if you like Triumphs lol. 59881[/snapback] Well, since we're on it... Guzzi had some good single cylinder racers, back in the day. Why can't they produce something similar now? Yes, I realize that product development costs a bunch, but follow the logic here: Piaggio owns both Aprilia & Guzzi. Guzzi isn't about to offer a scooter, nor does Piaggio want to encourage cannibalism among its marques in other areas, but Guzzi offering a 1cyl sport bike for market entry and prod racing classes might make some sense. By basing it on the head & piston from the 'Priller big twin, they've already got 1/2 the engine sorted; drop it on a Pegaso gearbox (or maybe just use the CVT off one of the big Atlantic scooters or Burgman?) and put it into a well-designed frame, toss in a few wins & BAM! Guzzi's getting good press from winning races again. Sales go up, more new riders buying Guzzi singles now means more old riders moving up in their favorite brand later, yada yada yada. Anyway, it's fun to think about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard100t Posted September 10, 2005 Share Posted September 10, 2005 I'd like to see them come out with a whole new engine design. When you think about it the current v twin is only the most recent design. Guzzi has been around 85 years & they have tried many different types of engines in the past. They could go with a modern 4 cylinder or liquid cooled anything they wanted. Brand loyalty goes a long way but a little variety wouldnt hurt either As long as they keep the Italian style in their design the bikes will sell. Everyone who wants the current engine design has that bike by now. its going to be hard to sell the same product over & over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeve Posted September 10, 2005 Share Posted September 10, 2005 I'd like to see them come out with a whole new engine design. When you think about it the current v twin is only the most recent design. Guzzi has been around 85 years & they have tried many different types of engines in the past. They could go with a modern 4 cylinder or liquid cooled anything they wanted. 59896[/snapback] I hear you, but my point was that they could bring a middleweight to market quickly, that would be a stepping stone to newer designs in their big roadburners. A wet, 4v 500cc single with a decent counterbalancer would have some appeal on the market, and give them a useful base from which to expand into the dual-sport market (which is bigger than the open-class touring market to begin with.) Yes, the small-block twin has been adapted in the past to make some nice adventure tourers, & may do so again in the future, but let's face it, that mill is too big & heavy for any amount of semi-serious off-roading. It's all just armchair quarterbacking, but it would be nice to see something beyond a restyling of the existing machines. Ride on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex-Corsa Posted September 11, 2005 Share Posted September 11, 2005 Yes, the small-block twin has been adapted in the past to make some nice adventure tourers, & may do so again in the future, but let's face it, that mill is too big & heavy for any amount of semi-serious off-roading.Ride on! Well I have to dissagre on you with that about heaviness of this Vtwin compared with a 4cylinder block.Yes there are 4cyl light engines but there are also heavy ones as well in morden motorcycles. AFAIK on the light weight engines that some superbike type jap. motorcycles have is more of a result of the metals used, ect.ect.There we have a degree of developement in metalurgy that Guzzi isn't able to reach. Yet there are custom Guzzis made in the market today suck as Dynotec's Guzzila having a Daytona motor with an amazing of 185kg full-wet weight ,and a sport of HTMoto having a old Leman engine with a 150kg or so (dry I think). SO if engine is a "weight problem" Late Guzzis('94 and on at least) have also the advantage of behaving at about 20% lighter of their actuall weight concerning agility!!. As far as Guzzi go to Offroad thing ?(If you mean the KTM type of thing), well I think that this cannot be done, first because Aprilia can provide such machines and second that isn't a Guzzi field that fits to it's tradition. What can be done is,to offer a smaller cubic motorcycle as a choice for some "first time" riders to get closer and into Guzzi Some better distribution (at least) of parts and service through the importers when and where needed. A little more advertising perhaps so the people know about. A nice looking and capable sport version, i.e. like the MGS1 for many of the sport riders that are not HP-junkies but want to enjoy riding such a capable "exotic" . Unfortunatelly most motorcycle brands get famous mostly because of racing(that costs million$$), and advertising and the magazines (even the so called "serious" ones) , as well ,that have nurture the attitude of Good bike =HP/Weight ratio ect.ect.ect. Forgetting about other qualities that make a motorcycle usefull and enjoyable. Guzzi has made a big developement in the shaft drive on their new models(Breva 1100 and Griso) that BMW hasn't even dreamed about it , yet I have not heared any praise from the press about it .(or someone show me I'm wrong) P.S. And something last If Guzzi had descided or be able to develop , (or you name it)and put a V8cylinder exotic motorcycle on the market with some 150-180PS or so, you'd see hordes of praise and racers wannabes running to buy one. And to tell you the truth better not be so, My impressions of Guzzi is that is reffering to the "mature" motorcyclist, the one who wants the long term beek relation , the one that knows what he wants from a bike. A bit developement won't hurt .though ,hopefully will help more of this kind getting to know the brand and don't get "victims" of the press and a stupid mentality towards motorcycling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeve Posted September 11, 2005 Share Posted September 11, 2005 Well I have to dissagre on you with that about heaviness of this Vtwin compared with a 4cylinder block. Uh, I was comparing the small-block vs. a single cyl. in the role of multipurpose bike. I think you didn't quite catch the train of thought in my last post... AFAIK on the light weight engines that some superbike type jap. motorcycles haveis more of a result of the metals used, ect.ect.There we have a degree of developement in metalurgy that Guzzi isn't able to reach. Nonsense! I'll certainly allow that Guzzi might not want to absorb the expense of using esoteric materials frequently found in the J4 loss-leader race replicas, but not have access to the metallurgy? Nope; the metallurgy is out there for those who want to use it. Development of new technology isn't the forte of other motorcycle manufacturers either, altho' they might be quicker to implement new tech that's just coming on line... As far as Guzzi go to Offroad thing ?(If you mean the KTM type of thing), well I think that this cannot be done, first because Aprilia can provide such machines and second that isn't a Guzzi field that fits to it's tradition. Well, Guzzi has done some adv. tourers before (using the small-block), besides the Quotas. The fact that only 1/2 a dozen or so made it Stateside doen't detract from the fact that they were part of the small-block sales success in Europe, and were part of keeping the company afloat when the sales of their big twins tanked mid-90s. The point I was trying to make was that Guzzi needs to be seen to be making something new, not just adapting existing designs in an attempt to trade on it's nameplate in another segment of the market. Guzzi has a lot of tradition, & its singles were successful in racing long after the handwriting was on the wall that their day was finished. By bringing a new single to market now, to expand their market base & get new Guzzisti enrolled in the list of potential future buyers, they have some hope of survival. What can be done is,to offer a smaller cubic motorcycle as a choice for some "first time" riders to get closer and into Guzzi Yep, that was my point. Some better distribution (at least) of parts and service through the importers when and where needed. A little more advertising perhaps so the people know about. A nice looking and capable sport version, i.e. like the MGS1 for many of the sport riders that are not HP-junkies but want to enjoy riding such a capable "exotic" . Yes, yes, & maybe. Frankly, I love the look of the MGS01, and its HiCam motor, but if Guzzi cannot provide it at a price that's competitive, it's not gonna matter. I'd rather see them make an homage to the Bicilindrica that uses the heads & as many internals as possible from Aprilia's SXV that's at least cost-comparable to the competition than to waste their energy trying to make the MGS01 performance competitive at a "nameplate surcharge" high price vs. their competitors... and have it fail! Unfortunatelly most motorcycle brands get famous mostly because of racing(that costs million$$), and advertising and the magazines (even the so called "serious" ones) , as well ,that have nurture the attitude of Good bike =HP/Weight ratio ect.ect.ect. Forgetting about other qualities that make a motorcycle usefull and enjoyable. Agreed. That's why Guzzi making something that fits into a production racing category that's supplied by multiple manufacturers (like 500cc singles) would at least make it possible for them to get their marque some favorable racing mention on a budget. Plus, they need the sales in a more "entry level" category! Let's face it, even the Breva 750 is much more bike than many (if not most!) people can or should start with. Guzzi has made a big developement in the shaft drive on their new models(Breva 1100 and Griso) that BMW hasn't even dreamed about it , yet I have not heared any praise from the press about it .(or someone show me I'm wrong) P.S. And something last If Guzzi had descided or be able to develop , (or you name it)and put a V8cylinder exotic motorcycle on the market with some 150-180PS or so, you'd see hordes of praise and racers wannabes running to buy one. Frankly, I *have* read some good press about the new Guzzi driveline, the press are sitting up & taking notice, & it's nice to see! As far as making an updated version of the Carcano V8, I hold serious reservations: too many parts, too limited market, too difficult to bring off w/ Guzzi's present limited resources. Honda Motor Co. was built on the 50cc Cub; Ford was built on the Model T: Guzzi needs to aim for the footlights, not the catwalks, if they want to regain their stature as a world-leader in the motorcycle marketplace. I'm just sayin'... Ride on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest goffredo Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Well we all know by now not to get carried away but Alan Cathcart is a well respected journalist and racer who has excellent connections with the Italian factories. No doubt He might have connections but it is unlikely that he knows more about the MGS-01 than the man who created it, Giuseppe Ghezzi. Ask Giuseppe and he'll tell you that there is no street legal MGS-01 at the horizon. The way I see it, that's pretty much all. Having said so, it won't do any harm to remember that Aprilia and Piaggio, separatedly and later together, both spent consideralble resources in the last five years on the development of new water cooled engines. It is not impossible that once this new engine become reality, we'll see the birth of an "MGS-02" or sort. The production lines of the Guzzi of the future will be likely to be filled with more tourers rather than race-replicas but the world wide interest around the MGS-01 (and its good results) demonstrated the the Sport soul of Guzzi is still alive. G. See you in Mandello! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex-Corsa Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Ask Giuseppe and he'll tell you that there is no street legal MGS-01 at the horizon.The way I see it, that's pretty much all. G. See you in Mandello! What about Giuseppe, Brian told me(email) that he was prepearing something new about in July. I had no news though. I am also to busy and forgot to write, plann to go from there, but the plan took more time than I calculated and still I'm stuck on my programm. I will write a email or a phone I guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 CAn't it be that the confusion is from a press release from moto guzzi, that might state that they will display a mgs01 on the show, what is read by someone that that is a street bike, which it isn't. That they only intend to put the mgs01 corsa on the stand. The thing Ghezzi told me a few month ago that the first thing new, will be a GS version of the breva 1100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex-Corsa Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Nonsense! I'll certainly allow that Guzzi might not want to absorb the expense of using esoteric materials frequently found in the J4 loss-leader race replicas, but not have access to the metallurgy? Nope; the metallurgy is out there for those who want to use it. Development of new technology isn't the forte of other motorcycle manufacturers either, altho' they might be quicker to implement new tech that's just coming on line...I'm just sayin'... Ride on! It's not nonsence, it just costs huge $$ .What I talked about is NOT about any "exotic" metals of some short. The Japs are advanced into doing different molecular structure on the same piece of metal in order to fit their specs in lightness-rigidity factor. The japs have perhaps the best metal proscessing industry. Even on knives for example, they can take a AUS8 metal ,and produce a better toughness and hardness piece (if needed) that equals to harder metals not so stainless but with the stailness qualities of the AUS8 I do imagine what they do in the bikes as well. And as I said accsesible yes but may as well be costy though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex-Corsa Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 The thing Ghezzi told me a few month ago that the first thing new, will be a GS version of the breva 1100. What is GS stands for? As about Ghezzi I was talking about a bike that I have said to him , I would like to have from, Specs-looks, ect.ect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 What is GS stands for?60050[/snapback] =Gelände Sport bmw R 1150 GS type Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbuzbee Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 A GS Guzzi wouldn't be practical: One of the great things about the BMW flat twin is when you get down a trail were either space or trail conditions won't allow you to turn the pig around you can DROP it on one cyclinder and spin it around! Of course, then you need a couple of buddies to help you pick it back up again. (this is true by the way - a method many AdvRiders employ!) I think Guzzi could take some cues from BMW however: Look at thier line-up, they aren't trying to compete with Ducati, Aprilla, Honda. They're creating new markets!! Everyone here is complaining about the "old" Guzzi V-Twin. Look at the range BMW has with the "old" Flat twin: R1100S R1150R R1200RT R1200ST R1150GSADV R1200GS and all the C1200 cruisers. jb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 Everyone here is complaining about the "old" Guzzi V-Twin. Look at the range BMW has with the "old" Flat twin: R1100S R1150R R1200RT R1200ST R1150GSADV R1200GS and all the C1200 cruisers Well they are 4V engines, very much the same layout as the guzzi 4V engine. But the new 1200 has same valve sizes as a mgs01. They can do the emisions and sound thing with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big J Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 I'd like to see a twenties board track racer type thing with a six litre marine diesel two stroke, wheelbarrow handlebars and twenty three inch wheels with brakes like shoe polish tins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiekb Posted September 12, 2005 Share Posted September 12, 2005 a GS Guzzi ? I've been looking at the Buell Ulysees but would much prefer a lighter 2V Guzzi with a luggage option and bonafide trail capbailities Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now