jrt Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 39 Euro? That's not a bad price at all. Gil, did you check the bolt for tightness? Maybe it just got loose is all. Second point- you mention you have a set of 3/8" drive allens. I hope they aren't Craftsman brand. Every set I've ever had (that'd be two sets) have been undersized. It's ok for low torque fittings, but not some of the other places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ratchethack Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Second point- you mention you have a set of 3/8" drive allens. I hope they aren't Craftsman brand. Every set I've ever had (that'd be two sets) have been undersized. It's ok for low torque fittings, but not some of the other places. Roger that! Craftsman tools are for the most part excellent IMHO, but their allen wrenches are notoriously undersized, and will make garbage out of socket-head bolts soon's you put any torque on 'em! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belfastguzzi Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I don't think that you should assume the worst until you have to. Start with the assumption that it could be a leaking gasket. This is a well known 'feature' of these engines, particularly the black wrinkle paint cases. Is that weep from the joint running down into the bolt, or is the bolt area definitely leaking also? From the photo, it could be the former. This joint leak can start, as in my case, as a persistentent weep and then dramitacally progress to a huge outpouring, with oil streaming back from the bike when it's on the move. Oil leaks tend to look worse than they are though. The problem here is that a section of gasket goes missing. Sometimes a bit can be seen protruding from the joint. They seem to be prone to damage at the factory assembly, though the black paint has also been blamed for causing the damage – getting into the joint, causing the gasket to slip/mis-seat – whatever, I can't remember. You could take it apart and replace the gasket (carefully), but I recommend sealing it externally. I cleaned the leaking joint area, sealed it with blue gasket sealer / instant gasket and then rubbed a black silicone over the top. This repair works 100% and it's practically invisible. You wouldn't see it if you didn't know it was there. Search Tech Topics for oil leaks, timing chest leaks etc, etc, – as there is plenty more info on this particular type of leak, out there somewhere, including pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchbob Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 All good advice, this, Dr Gil. Please, please don't feel bad about about crashing your Guzzi: it's what they're made for, I've found, and we're all entitled to play the prat once in a while. We Guzzisti are the hardest prats, of course. It's just possible you have a casting crack of some sort, but I think it's more likely you have simply unsettled everything, including where the oil drains to. If it sounds good, and doesn't continue to gush, run it gently for a bit, keep wiping it to see where exactly the leak comes from, and don't do anything drastic until it's settled down....is my advice. If a small leak continues, follow the advice you've been given here to fix it. I'm sure you've checked the whole bike over really carefully as well, after a spill. You say you used to be a Triumph man. I once fell off my Trident standing stock still - takes some doing! And I was sober. Happily it landed on my wife, who was sitting on the pillion at the time, with little damage done. Bon courage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 ....don't feel bad about about crashing your Guzzi: it's what they're made for.... Frenchbob, I fear somewhere along the line, you have misunderstood a fundamental principle... KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchbob Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 One of many, I fear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luhbo Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 ....I crashed due to my own stupidity. I neglected to put my sidestand up (PO had disconected the shut off) on a mountain road. The first sweeping left hander "pole vaulted" my bike and I about 200 feet down the roadway. We never hit anything and didn't tumble, just a slide...grinding away all the "hanging out bits" on the left side of the bike and myself (broken rib/collapsed lung, ground off fingertips). 68387[/snapback] Suppose the bits with the bike are not the biggest problems you had to deal with the last few months, are they? Reminds me what I've seen in one of the last 'Motorrad's: Patient, lots of blessures: "Doctor, doctor, be honest, how bad is it?!?" Doctor: "Well, exhaust bent, mirrors cracked, tank some dents, probably all can get well again." Patient: "Oh, thank God!" Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gil Posted November 23, 2005 Author Share Posted November 23, 2005 Just to keep everyone updated...things came up today and I only had a moment to deal with the bike so I decided not to start anything till I could give it proper attention. I did give it another looking over and cannot, even with a high intensity halogen light find and cracks. I think my plan from here is to take it back up to temperature and see what develops. If everything appears the same then I am going with the silicone on the back of the bolt head and try it again. I think that seem is "weeping" for about 2 inches higher up on the engine also. Should I try to seal that with silicone on the outside or is that WAY too cheesy a thing to do and even if it worked temporarily it would be a problem that I'm going to have to deal with down the road anyway? A fellow Guzzista (stogie bill-Scura) has volunteered to come by on Friday (Thurs. is Thanksgiving and I'm sure nothing will get done then) to give me a hand and another pair of eyes to look at what I'm dealing with. Backup plan is to go for the timing cover (39 Euros IS a great price!) as I suspect that that motor mount may have done some damage during the crash. The engine did slide along the asphalt long enough to grind the engine guard off that side and that mount is SO close to where it's leaking. I'm not sure if I'm up to the job of replacing it myself and may have to run it down to the dealership. Also...is it possible part of my problem here is that it MAY have been running dino oil (I hadn't changed the oil in it since buying it...I only put 1500 miles on it and the oil had been changed by the PO when he sold it to me) and I put in synth oil? Anyway, stay tuned and thank you all so much for your support and help. thumbsup: edited to add: Oh yeah, I ment to mention that I will do that check you mentioned Baldini of removing the engine mount and see what happens...and yes jrt, I did check the bolt for tightness and it was a "bit" loose. I got another 1/2 turn on it before it was snug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badmotogoozer Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 A fellow Guzzista (stogie bill-Scura) has volunteered to come by on Friday 68467[/snapback] If he offers you a cookie, just say NO! Even if it's choco chip and macadamia! Rj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeBenGuzzi Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 If he offers you a cookie, just say NO! Even if it's choco chip and macadamia! Rj 68469[/snapback] I love that f'n picture. its so perfect. I chuckle everytime I see's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belfastguzzi Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Should I try to seal that with silicone on the outside or is that WAY too cheesy a thing to do and even if it worked temporarily it would be a problem that I'm going to have to deal with down the road anyway? 68467[/snapback] well I don't think that there's anything cheesy about doing a repair that works 100%, hasn't deteriorated in the freezing cold and damp over the previous winter of living outside or through the heat of running all day in the summer, is invisible – and cost nothing to do. But if you want to take the case off... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gil Posted November 24, 2005 Author Share Posted November 24, 2005 well I don't think that there's anything cheesy about doing a repair that works 100%, hasn't deteriorated in the freezing cold and damp over the previous winter of living outside or through the heat of running all day in the summer, is invisible – and cost nothing to do. But if you want to take the case off... 68480[/snapback] Ack! I fear I've offended you! That was totally NOT my intention. I appreciate being given ALL my options and this is certainly one and one that appeals to me (given my somewhat limited wrenching abilities) for it's "do-a-tability" (if that's a word...probably not). My concern was simply that it might be a too easy a fix and that I might have to eventually deal with the reality (possibly on the road in the middle of nowhere) that I have a gasket that's gone bad. I just don't want to take an easy fix now for a potential problem "down the road." If this fix has hung together for you as you say then I'm most certainly kicking it up to the front of my options list. Meanwhile, I'm refusing ALL cookies, no matter what kinds of nuts are involved from Guzzistas offering me their help...so don't even try to tempt me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emry Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Definatley try the external fix first. My gasket blew out twice in that same exact spot. Not trusting my dealer to repair it again i just used some black silicone. I cleaned off a small section of the paint first using carb cleaner so the silicone would stick. Worked like a charm. If you do decide to pull the front cover don't forget to get the front crank seal. They also seem to be delicate. But be careful with the carb cleaner it will quickly take off the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gil Posted November 24, 2005 Author Share Posted November 24, 2005 Definatley try the external fix first. My gasket blew out twice in that same exact spot. Not trusting my dealer to repair it again i just used some black silicone. I cleaned off a small section of the paint first using carb cleaner so the silicone would stick. Worked like a charm. If you do decide to pull the front cover don't forget to get the front crank seal. They also seem to be delicate. But be careful with the carb cleaner it will quickly take off the paint. 68494[/snapback] ok and good tip...but frankly your avatar is freakin' me out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Stewart Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Bingo!, Many of the 02 bikes had this leak, Guzzi found out the the leak was caused by paint being on the gasket surface. So, do clean off the paint from the surfaces when replacing the front cover gasket. Also, I like silicone sealant but not with a paper gasket. When used with a paper gasket, the gasket will want to push out away from the gasket surface (don't ask how I know ) when tightened up, stick with the old tried and true aviation sealant with paper gaskets. Mike Definatley try the external fix first. My gasket blew out twice in that same exact spot. Not trusting my dealer to repair it again i just used some black silicone. I cleaned off a small section of the paint first using carb cleaner so the silicone would stick. Worked like a charm. If you do decide to pull the front cover don't forget to get the front crank seal. They also seem to be delicate. But be careful with the carb cleaner it will quickly take off the paint. 68494[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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