ElectroSport Regulator Rectifier

[dlaing]

My charging system has been failing when the engine warms up.

I made the possibly false assumption that it is the regulator, based on it being heat related.

So I ordered the Electrosport ESR510 from

http://www.electrosport.com/shopping_regul...rod_esr510.html

also known as www.electrexusa.com

Their regulator is made in Argentina and has a good reputation.

It arrived by UPS ground less than 24hours after ordering, so off I went to try to hook it up.

The problem is that the wires don't all seem to match up.

I am 99.9% sure I ordered the right regulator, but I may have to rig something to make this work.

I'll try to post a diagram later with the exact problem, but if anyone has had experience with this unit, please let me know.

The short version of the story is that there does not seem to be a wire coming out of the regulator to match up with the red/black wire seen in Carl's fine diagram.

The OEM regulator has a black wire coming out that goes into the red/black wire.

The ESR510 has a Green wire, specified in the instructions to be the ground wire.

All the other wires seem to match up fine.

The OEM has the following:

two yellow that go into two yellow.

Two red that go into one Red/Green

one white that goes into a lightt blue

one black that goes into a red/black

and a ground wire hooked to the mounting screw, but not going into the regulator.

The ESR510 has

two yellow to alternator

one red to battery positive

one white to alternator warning light

and one green to ground

I used an OHM meter to see if the green wire was continuous with the regulator housing. It is not.

Thanks in advance.

[dlaing]

Okay, I think I understand what they want now.

If only I could read and comprehend worth a dam.

Two wire stator connection

Hook the wires up according to the DIAGRAM 1 if the stator only has two wires coming from it. The two YELLOW wires are the phase inputs, the GREEN connects to the battery negative, the RED connects to the battery positive and the WHITE is the charge warning light output.

NOTE: Voltage sensing input from the ignition switch is built into the part. No Black wire is necessary.

You will have a RED wire left over. Make sure you cap it off, so it can’t short out to the frame. Our RR51 is designed to work properly and safely without the 30A main fuse in the system.

So, if I am reading correctly, when they say no black wire is necessary, they mean that the black wire going to the Red/Black wire is no longer necessary, and that the Red/Black wire can be capped off.

Furthermore they want the Red and Green wires to go directly to the battery, do not pass fuses or frame points, and therefore the regulator does not fry if the fuse blows if there is no fuse to blow.

[dlaing]

So here is my plan:

Before I damage my bike, does anyone see anything wrong with this plan?

The Yellow wires connect to the Yellow wires.

The Green wire goes directly to the battery's ground.

In addition to grounding at the battery, perhaps I should still tie the green wire into the frame and regulator body just to be well grounded.

The Red wire bypasses the fuse and goes directly to the battery.

Fuse 3 and the red/green wire becomes obsolete, but could have a future use as an unswitched hot wire for an accessory or the headlights, and it could carry a pretty heavy load.

The red/black wire also becomes obsolete, but could have a future use as a switched hot wire, with a light load.

[callison]

Extracting the text from the instructions:

 

Two wire stator connection Hook the wires up according to the DIAGRAM 1 if the stator only has two wires coming from it.The two YELLOW wires are the phase inputs, the GREEN connects to the battery negative,the RED connects to the battery positive and the WHITE is the charge warning light output. NOTE: Voltage sensing input from the ignition switch is built into the part. You will have a RED wire left over. Make sure you cap it off,so it can’t short out to the frame.Our RR51 is designed to work properly and safely without the 30A main fuse in the system. GREEN: Negative ( – ) RED: Positive( + ) WHITE Charge Warning Light 12V Battery YELLOW YELLOW ALTERNATOR - 2 CABLE TYPE

 

V11 wiring:

reg/green - fused battery circuit

red/black - voltage sense

yellow(s) - alternator leads

black - ground

case - ground as well

 

That seems simple enough. Personally, I would leave the fused part of the circuit in place (red/green) since you won't have to change any wiring and if something goes wrong somewhere, you at least get an indication. It doesn't look as if the RR51 gives any kind of indication if 30A is exceeded. The fuse will.

 

The red/black is unneeded. Just leave the connector empty.

 

The black wire is routed to the existing regulator mount and it is necessary for the Ducati Electronica regulator, not because it's the ground lead to the battery as shown on all of the diagrams but because it also is the ground point for a couple items in the harness if I recall correctly from when I put the harness back in my bike. I certainly remember having problems with something until I found that errant black wire and hooked it up. Therefore, you should hook the black Guzzi wire to the green RR51 wire.

 

The yellow wires are one for one. No polarity, that's the AC from the alternator.

[dlaing]

Thanks Carl!

So, here is plan B

Oooops, where I said cap off here and here, just cap off here

And I'll be sure to confirm that I am getting a good ground from both the mounting point and the frame.

[dlaing]

So that seemed to do the trick.

This regulator produces voltage at a much lower RPM than the OEM

The only downside so far is that peak voltage never gets up to 14V.

Perhaps my OEM regulator was not bad.

Battery connections are tight, but may need some TLC.

In any case, my 30A fuse looks a little dubious.(plastic pulled off metal...)

I'll deal with that after Christmas.

[callison]

The Ducati Electronica unit uses a balanced thyristor bridge which gives better output at the top end, but requires more voltage to fire making it less suitable for lower rpms/voltages. The ElectroSport uses an industry standard approach full wave bridge rectifier which is more efficient at the bottom but loses some voltage at the top. Operationally on a street Guzzi, it should be a wash between either type but with the nod going to the ElectroSport if you just chuff around town at lower rpms a lot.

[dlaing]

I suppose either Regulator will allow for roughly the same Amperage if demanded by accessories.

But the way a battery demands amperage is different.

My concern is that I won't get enough Voltage to keep the Hawker fully charged.

I suppose on the positive side, in addition to getting more volts below 2000 RPM, light bulbs, relays, and accessories will last longer.

 

A note for anyone installing the ESR510, you will need a pair of 35mm bolts and some slightly oversized washers. ( I used 30mm bolts, but they are barely long enough.)

Longer bolts are needed because the body of the regulator is thicker and larger washers should be used because where the bolts go there is more freeplay to allow for larger bolts, different bolt spacing, etc.

[dlaing]

You can see how much bigger it is, allowing for better cooling.

And note the two bolt holes are replaced by large slots.

[Guest MikeC]

You can see how much bigger it is, allowing for better cooling.

And note the two bolt holes are replaced by large slots.

71802[/snapback]

 

If it's not to much trouble could you post a picture of it mounted on the bike.

 

Mike

[Alex-Corsa]

My charging system has been failing when the engine warms up.

I made the possibly false assumption that it is the regulator, based on it being heat related.

 

What was finnaly the problem (if not the rectifier-regulator)

[dlaing]

What was finnaly the problem (if not the rectifier-regulator)

71917[/snapback]

I am still not one hundred percent sure.

My Ducati regulator when working would put out something like 14.3-14.5V, and then it started to malfunction and put out a wildly fluctuating 12.xVolts after the engine had warmed.

A cold engine put out a full charge, so everytime I checked for a while I was getting a good reading, so I suspected my battery.

I got a battery charger, and the battery proved to be fine.

Then I finally checked the voltage with the engine hot, and discovered it not, or barely charging.

So, I ordered the ESR.

With the ESR I was only getting a maximum output of about 13.5 Volts.

I had installed it without further troubleshooting, so although it was only putting out 13.5V, atleast it was charging, even when hot. So, the symptoms changed.

I was not happy withthe 13.5V so I trouble shooted a little further and determined that I was getting 13.9 volts coming out of the regulator, but the Red/Green line was creating a drop in voltage, that I narrowed down to somewhere between the fuse and the regulator. An ohmmeter showed 0.2ohms. The wiring diagram showed no connectors along the way.

So, I just ran a line of 12 Gauge, and an inline 30A fuse, from the regulator to the battery, tested, and got 13.9V from about 2000 to about 4000 RPMs. It drops a bit after 4000RPM to about 13.5 or so...

I'll probably contact their tech support to see if that is normal.

But now at 1100 RPM I am getting about 13V, so I have fewer worries while idling at red lights.

I want to get the engine hot a few times and make sure that the alternator was not the problem.

My guess is that something happened to the Red/Green line, the fuse did not blow, but looked like the plastic had melted just a little, and because of the increased resistance, the regulator had to push harder to charge through the bad line and eventually gave up.

 

PS, I'll try to take a picture of the regulator. It looks pretty unnoticeable.

[dlaing]

If it's not to much trouble could you post a picture of it mounted on the bike.

 

Mike

71916[/snapback]

Sorry about the delay!

click on the thumbnails for bigger picture

Note the flash exagerates the bling factor in the second two shots.

The first shot may exagerate how unnoticable it is.

 

So far it is charging fine!

[Guest MikeC]

Sorry about the delay!

click on the thumbnails for bigger picture

Note the flash exagerates the bling factor in the second two shots.

The first shot may exagerate how unnoticable it is.

 

So far it is charging fine!

73368[/snapback]

Thanks for the pictures. Looks fine.

 

Mike

[Enzo]

Dlaing,

 

I have the same symptoms as you did with the melting 30 amp fuse. I have my new regulator (ElectroSport) right here and ready to go. It is a little confusing. Here are the wires from the Guzzi that attached to the Ducati regulator:

 

 

So I was a little confused that the new regulator does not have all the wires to connect. I've looked at your posts, and I think I know what to do. I no longer have a dash or idiot lights on the Guzzi, so I think it might be very simple. What I intend to do is simply connect the two yellow wires to the two yellow alternator wires. Then run the red and green wires directly to the battery. Since I have no sensor lights, I intend to leave all the other wires 'dangle' - capped off. That would mean the white wire from the new regulator and both conectors from the Guzzi (the red/black with blue plus the red/green wire).

 

C. said something about splicing in the Guzzi black ground wire into the new regulator wire. Can't I just connect it to the mount as it was before? I also take it that I will no longer need a 30 amp. fuse in the fuse box.

 

Is this correct?