Another oil change related question

[bigbikerrick]

Today after returning from a 100 mile ride, I drained the oil on the V11, since I changed the filter at the last oil change 3000 miles ago I decided to not drop the pan and just change the oil, leaving the old filter( my bike has 7K miles on it) I was surprised at how black my oil was, I mean it looked like black ink! Is that normal? I use castrol GTX 20/50 dino oil. also I put in 3.5 quarts and my oil level was about 1/2 inch above the top mark on the dipstick, checking it with the bike perfectly level,and screwing in the stick. I am wondering is 3.5 quarts too much when not replacing the filter? is it ok to leave the level 1/2 inch above the high mark,or will that cause leaks,or blown seals. I just left the bike in the garage until morning to see what the experts here have to say... Thanks

[twhitaker]

3 1/2 quarts is too much. I only use 3 even when I change the filter. You should remove the excess or it will get removed, the most likely path being through the air box. You might be able to draw off the excess using a turkey baster through the fill port.

 

I use the same oil and my oil comes out pretty black although I do not think it is a charactaristic limited to dino oil.

[Alex-Corsa]

is it ok to leave the level 1/2 inch above the high mark,or will that cause leaks,or blown seals. I just left the bike in the garage until morning to see what the experts here have to say... Thanks 

 

Too much.Yes it'll cause leaks and blow seals. It's not healthy situation for the bike.

Dunno what the quart equivelant to liter is. I use 2,6 Lt without filter change and 2,9+lit whaen also the oil filter is changed on my 1100 Sport i

 

It's black, yes, that Gastrol was changed to the end of it's performing mark.

I think it is semi- synthetic (or synthetic based oil and that's not the best you can use)Try full synthetic ,if you change it in 3000Mil. then it wouldn't be at the end of it's perormance abilities and the motor will stay much healthier in the long run.

 

Personally I use a 15-50 Oil (ONLY full synthetic) and that viscosity is a good one for most tempratures the bike is going to be used.The 20-50 is suggested for big 2 cylinder bikes and very good at bit higher temps in summer as well) I noticed my bike was performing better with the 15-50 in colder temratures and didn't have any compromise in summer. That's about my experience in the 40+K km in my 1100 Sport i

 

It's hard to get a full synth 15-50 and the two most reliable marks are Motul V300 Competition and the Rock Oil the latest is also used by good tunning "houses" in Europe such as Dynotec(that builds Guzzis with 140+HP) and the Daes Mototec

who also have special art Guzzi tunning shop. So I said I'll give them a try ,oil is performing good , though I will switch back to the Motul sometime ,to further notice the difference.

 

In some new Guzzis (i.e. Cafe Sport) an oil like 5-40 is suggested, then dunno what should be the better but always full synth race is a good choice. Agip is also a very good quality oil.

 

P.S. When or if you switch between oil brands,oil filter change is also good to be done.

[Guest ratchethack]

I was surprised at how black my oil was, I mean it looked like black ink! Is that normal?

No. And it ain't good.

 

Rick, IMHO the explanation lies in the answer to another couple of questions.

 

What kind of an air filter do you use, and have you cleaned & oiled it on schedule?

 

You live in a dusty environment. There's only one way all that dust can get into your oil, and that's through the air filter. One way or another, there's a price to be paid for keeping it out. What it boils down to is - Are you willing to pay the price? If so, how much and how often are you willing to pay that price? The only options open to you are the quality of air filtration you choose and the frequency of your oil changes.

 

The following isn't directed at you, Rick - but there seem to be a few who [ahem] might benefit from a little "direction" at this point... - Those who have no appreciation for analytical discussion, don't know what "analytical" means, don't believe anything that's published on the Web, can't comprehend or won't try to comprehend testing and/or test results, believe that the most important consideration in choice of an air filter is the styling statement it makes, believe that dust in the intake doesn't matter, or just plain couldn't possibly care less may now retire to the "What Time is it?" Thread.

 

Rick, if you're still using an Amsoil air filter, as you indicated in the "WHAAAAT, there's a DOWNSIDE to K&N filters - and What's This - NO UPSIDE?" thread, the tests in the Duramax study (linked in the opening post of that thread) show the Amsoil filter to be a pretty good filter in its ability to capture dirt, but the Amsoil takes a significant departure from the rest of the filters in the study in three of the parameters tested that IMHO would be important to you because of where you live and ride.

 

(EDIT: I'm most definitely NOT slamming Rick's choice of air filter! Quite the contrary! Please read carefully before responding!! )

 

The Amsoil filter's accumulative capacity to hold dirt was the lowest of the filters tested (less than 1/3 by weight of the best in the test), it's dust loading curve was the steepest, and its time to restriction limit was the lowest. Because you live in "the dust capital of the southwest", this might suggest that not a different filter, but (by my take on the results anyway) it suggests that frequent cleaning and oiling would keep your engine oil cleaner. The Duramax study also suggests to me that doing this would make the Amsoil filter a very good choice - among the very best, in fact (among those in the study) - for the heavy ambient dust conditions where you ride.

 

'Course, you could always can the Amsoil filter altogether and go with the professionally-endorsed, king-o'-the-dyno-charts, and "Baja Proven" K&N!! Oh, wait - you already tried that on your Trooper, didn't you? Ya gotta wonder what your Guzzi oil would look like with a K&N?!

 

BAA TJM & YMMV

[badmotogoozer]

 

Those who have no appreciation for analytical discussion, don't know what "analytical" means, don't believe anything that's published on the Web, can't comprehend or won't try to comprehend testing and/or test results, believe that the most important consideration in choice of an air filter is the styling statement it makes, believe that dust in the intake doesn't matter, or just plain couldn't possibly care less may now retire to the "What Time is it Now?" Thread.

 

73087[/snapback]

 

I have already analyzed the K&N thread. I would rather argue creation vs. evolution with the pope.

 

I still think that test was bunk.

 

Black is much too dark for the oil, and Ratchet is right that it may be time for a new air filter. Get a K&N - you'll never regret it.

 

Rj

[Guest ratchethack]

I still think that test was bunk.

Based on what evidence, if I may humbly ask?

Ratchet is right that it may be time for a new air filter.

 

Ryan, with all due respect, I don't think you're paying much attention to what you're responding to. I didn't suggest that Rick get a new filter - in fact, I suggested the one he has is a good choice!!

 

It's clear that you have no respect for the Duramax study, and that's fine. But you haven't provided a credible REASON for your disbelief (credible evidence - such as a study of equal or greater credibility than the Duramax study that would indicate that it's findings are invalid. That would suffice.)

Get a K&N - you'll never regret it.

If you read Rick's post in the "WHAAAAT" thread, I don't think he's likely to throw out his Amsoil and put in a K&N. Y'see, he's already had a K&N in his Trooper, and he's already regretted it (!) based on pretty good ORIGINAL, personal (though quite basic) credible evidence that K&N's are not as effective at keeping dirt out of intakes as other filters!!! This of course corroborates the findings of the Duramax study - and many others.

[badmotogoozer]

Ratchet is right, you should get a K&N air filter. Make sure you oil it liberally.

 

Rj

[DeBenGuzzi]

Based on what evidence, if I may humbly ask?

 

Ryan, with all due respect, I don't think you're reading very carefully.  I didn't suggest that Rick get a new filter.

 

It's clear that you have no respect for the Duramax study, and that's fine.  But you haven't provided a credible REASON for your disbelief (credible evidence - such as a study of equal or greater credibility than the Duramax study that would indicate that it's findings are invalid would be good).

73109[/snapback]

OH BOY, here we go, Now all the threads are rolling over into each other and its just a downward spiral into what implodes every other web forum out there. Well it was fun while it lasted

Nah its cool lets just say Air is good crap in air bad, You decide how much you want of each. and be merry.

[badmotogoozer]

I'm just messin with you ratchet - forget I even mention K&N in this thread...

 

I felt that the K&N Duramax test discussion ended with Jim's post #22.

 

Seems to me any test that claims that there is no benefit to increasing airflow to an air pump has to have an ulterior motive of some sort. That's just plain physics. I was suspicious of how the data was reported, seems awfully slanted towards AC. Suspicious that a factory filter was found to be so superior while K&N, likely the largest competitor to a stock air filter in any vehicle was found to be so poor. (not saying that the K7N is the bomb, for certain I agree that a filter that lets more air in will also let in more dirt.)

 

I just find this test to be suspicious to one who is inherently suspicious of all internet information. It's scope and extent of its testing was not great enough to make the statements they concluded.

 

I believe the "information highway" is rapidly becoming the "misinformation highway" , an unregulated medium in which advertisers are free to post anything they wish in any disguise they think will sell their product. There are no internet fact checkers.

 

Rj

[Guest ratchethack]

OK, Ryan, you've said as much before. But as I also mentioned before, I believe that some on this Forum happen to appreciate valid studies and both recognize and apreciate credibly conducted, scientifically based, impartial analysis of facts when they see it in a comparison study - especially when it's well corroborated by so many other similar studies, and when they believe it may present real value to them in terms of improving quality of maintenance.

 

Those who don't have any appreciation need not pay any attention. But if you're not paying attention, why post nothing but disagreement without contributing anything at all to back it up?! If you're not paying attention, what's your motivation to post at all?! By the results of the last thread, I think there are at least a few on this Forum who DO have an appreciation for the content of the air filter discussion, and actually have an interest in sharing and discussing technically detailed aspects of what we consider important to maintaining our Guzzi's.

 

This is, after all a Technical Forum, ain't it?!?

 

Just checkin'!

 

BAA, TJM, & YMMV

[badmotogoozer]

That's why I stopped posting to the K&N thread.. those who wish to believe may do so, I've said my peace.

 

All the best in '06 ratchet!!

 

Rj

[Guest ratchethack]

Thanks, Ryan.

 

Same to you. No hard feelings, I hope.

 

Catch ya on the flip-flop.

[badmotogoozer]

 

Same to you.  No hard feelings, I hope.

 

 

73118[/snapback]

 

Never, my friend!

 

Rj

[DeBenGuzzi]

If you're not paying attention, what's your motivation to post at all?!

73115[/snapback]

Thats when I feel its my civic duty to post nonsensical crap to hide my extreme level of mechanical eneptness.

[bigbikerrick]

No.  And it ain't good. 

 

Rick, IMHO the explanation lies in the answer to another couple of questions. 

 

What kind of an air filter do you use, and have you cleaned & oiled it on schedule?

 

You live in a dusty environment.  There's only one way all that dust can get into your oil, and that's through the air filter.  One way or another, there's a price to be paid for keeping it out.  What it boils down to is - Are you willing to pay the price?  If so, how much and how often are you willing to pay that price?  The only options open to you are the quality of air filtration you choose and the frequency of your oil changes.

 

The following isn't directed at you, Rick - but there seem to be a few who [ahem] might benefit from a little "direction" at this point... <_ those who have no appreciation for analytical discussion don know what means believe anything that published on the web can comprehend or won try to testing and test results most important consideration in choice of an air filter is styling statement it makes dust intake doesn matter just plain couldn possibly care less may now retire time thread. src="%7B___base_url___%7D/uploads/emoticons/default_anigrin.gif" alt=":grin:">

 

Rick, if you're still using an Amsoil air filter, as you indicated in the "WHAAAAT, there's a DOWNSIDE to K&N filters - and What's This - No UPSIDE?" thread, the tests in the Duramax study (linked in the opening post of that thread) show the Amsoil filter to be a pretty good filter in its ability to capture dirt, but the Amsoil takes a significant departure from the rest of the filters in the study in three of the parameters tested that IMHO would be important to you because of where you live and ride. 

 

(EDIT:  I'm most definitely NOT slamming Rick's choice of air filter!  Quite the contrary!  Please read carefully before responding!! )

 

The Amsoil filter's accumulative capacity to hold dirt was the lowest of the filters tested (less than 1/3 by weight of the best in the test), it's dust loading curve was the steepest, and its time to restriction limit was the lowest.  Because you live in "the dust capital of the southwest", this might suggest that not a different filter, but (by my take on the results anyway) it suggests that frequent cleaning and oiling would keep your engine oil cleaner.  The Duramax study also suggests to me that doing this would make the Amsoil filter a very good choice - among the very best, in fact (among those in the study) - for the heavy ambient dust conditions where you ride.

 

'Course, you could always can the Amsoil filter altogether and go with the professionally-endorsed, king-o'-the-dyno-charts, and "Baja Proven" K&N!!  Oh, wait - you already tried that on your Trooper, didn't you?  Ya gotta wonder what your Guzzi oil would look like with a K&N?! <_ src="%7B___base_url___%7D/uploads/emoticons/default_laugh.png" alt=":lol:">

 

BAA TJM & YMMV

73087[/snapback]

Ratchethack, I used amsoil air filters in some of my other vehicles, but my Guzzi has the stock factory paper unit,as does my vulcan nomad,and cbr 600 f4i,and 97 magna.on all my other bikes the oil has never come out as black as the Guzzis,using GTX castrol dino in all bikes except the nomad which I put rotella dino 14/45 in. I was thinking the blackness may be caused by combustion carbon???? I change all the bikes oil every 3K miles along with EMGO brand filters,or wal mart brand if available. Thanks for the reply!