When the ride comes together

[Guest Nogbad]

Yesterday I rode the Firebolt 140 miles getting the break in underway.

 

This afternoon however, my wife decided I was still looking restless, and told me to take the Guzzi out. (She obviously realises that the more you ride, the more you want to ride).

 

It was one of those perfect rides where everything seems to come together. The corners just flowed, overtakes were dispatched with spot on timing and not a near miss or a trouser moment from start to finish. The only thing to mar the exercise was a persistent false neutral going from 4th to 5th once the 'box was warm.

 

I have been thinking about the differences between the two bikes. The Guzzi is definitely the more relaxed in terms of riding position and has MUCH superior brakes and a lighter clutch. There is less in the handling than you might expect. The 'bolt is very "chuckable" and for some reason it has increased my confidence in the bends. A pleasant side effect is that I found myself throwing the V11 about today, and finding it takes it well. My Guzzi corner speeds were way up and a 1/4" has come off my "chicken strips". Inexplicable. Of course the V11 is broken in fully, and so my desire for full throttle could be taken care of. The Guzzi engine is not the "lugger" some people make it out to be. There is a distinct and almost stinkwheel like power band between 5000 and 7000 rpm that is manic and satisfying. The only handling foible on the V11 after some trial and analysis today is that on certain undulating bad surfaces it skips at the back and tries to stand up and run wide. On smooth blacktop it tracks perfectly. I can't dial this out, and I blame the weight of the final drive.

 

The two bikes couldn't be more different or in their own way more unusual. One is not better than the other, and each has its strengths and weaknesses.

 

Controls have their differences. The Guzzi has a really nice light clutch, absolutely excellent brakes in action and in feel and very stable steering. The 'bolt has a better throttle action, and a far better gear shift action, let down by a clutch that is almost on a par with an old Norton for heaviness. This is not helped by my girly small hands as the lever span is too great and is not adjustable. The 'bolt is much more sensitive in the bends. It handles superbly but you need to be concentrating! The WORST feature of the 'bolt for me is still the grabby front brake, and the WORST feature of the Guzzi is the gearbox. Maybe mine needs attention, but when warm the lever sticks going down the 'box until you let the clutch back out, and there is the matter of the false neutral.

 

Anyway, it was a great ride out, and confirms my continuing intention to keep both bikes. After all, you don't give up fine wine just because you like to drink beer.

[Guest ratchethack]

Nog, I seems y'er enjoying them both, and that's exactly as it should be!

 

I think I figured out that I outweigh you by 7 kg. - not much. Since you've taken to comparing the handling of the MG to the handling of the 'Bolt again without having y'er suspension properly dialed-in, I'm compelled again to urge you to re-spring and set-up y'er chassis properly (both of 'em), recalling (again) the transformative experience it had in my case on my Guzzi.

 

Not that the Guzzi could ever match the handling of the 'Bolt in the shorter twisties, ('course it'll always be an apples to oranges comparison regardless of road or speed) but I suspect you'd find a whole new world of joy in the Guz at higher speeds - perhaps open new frontiers not even approachable by the 'Bolt?

 

Having 2 bikes myself, I've often experienced a repeated new appreciation for each one after having logged a few hundred miles on one and then riding the other. If you get the suspensions set up on both (at least as well as I have on my bikes) I suspect you'd find that today's experience could be surpassable - on BOTH bikes!

[Guest Nogbad]

Ratchet, the limiting factors are my courage, closely followed by my skill, and then a long way behind those are the suspension and tyres.

 

If I am investing money I am buying training and track time.

[Guest ratchethack]

Ratchet, the limiting factors are my courage, closely followed by my skill, and then a long way behind those are the suspension and tyres.

 

If I am investing money I am buying training and track time.

Ah, then - my apologies for having appeared to question y'er priorities, Nog!

 

In my case, my riding is such that I never seem to quite approach even my mediocre limits of courage OR skill, so suspension comes in at #1 on the priority list...

[Guest Nogbad]

Ah, then - my apologies for having appeared to question y'er priorities, Nog!

 

In my case, my riding is such that I never seem to quite approach even my mediocre limits of courage OR skill, so suspension comes in at #1 on the priority list...

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I mean if I want to go faster I will get more mph per $ by investing in improved riding skills and track practice than in fancy springs and shocks. Mind you, I think most people who modify do it for the sake of it and not for any discernible practical advantage on the road. (Though they won't admit it). In a way, the "chrome and tassels" Harley brigade are more honest than the "tricked up" sportsbike crowd.

 

You know what I'm getting at!

[Guest ratchethack]

In a way, the "chrome and tassels" Harley brigade are more honest than the "tricked up" sportsbike crowd.

 

You know what I'm getting at!

[not_scooter_Scura!]

>My Guzzi corner speeds were way up and a 1/4" has come off my "chicken strips". Inexplicable. Of course the V11 is broken in fully, and so my desire for full throttle could be taken care of

 

YES! exactly....it took me till riding my KTM fast before I could appreciate riding the Scura faaast.

 

> The Guzzi engine is not the "lugger" some people make it out to be. There is a distinct and almost stinkwheel like power band between 5000 and 7000 rpm that is manic and satisfying.

 

 

no, not the lugger at all, viceral, spritely, charming...but never 'chug-a-lug'...

 

>The two bikes couldn't be more different or in their own way more unusual. One is not better than the other, and each has its strengths and weaknesses.

 

OK, but the V11 IS my weakness, bella.

 

>...WORST feature of the Guzzi is the gearbox. Maybe mine needs attention, but when warm the lever sticks going down the 'box until you let the clutch back out, and there is the matter of the false neutral.

 

I dunno, I have to say, my 'box (err gearbox that is) is very slick, if you have the time & money please get it looked at...  I nevre have false neutrals, or 'sticky' gear lever action, lucky or low miles perhaps , but shows that it can be precise & satisfying, maybe more to do with light Scura clutch...

 

>Anyway, it was a great ride out, and confirms my continuing intention to keep both bikes. After all, you don't give up fine wine just because you like to drink beer.

 

 

 

yes, yes & yes, keep 'em, ride 'em...let's face it, both bikes will still be doing what they are doing for you today long into the next decade.

 

Thanks for the comparo...written by a true motorcyclist at heart, & that is what it's all about to me.

 

good stuff

[Ballacraine]

That is precisely why I have three bikes.

 

I like the soul of the Triumph Triple engine. Not hugeley powerful in the guise I have, but smooth, comfortable and a wonderful banshee wail through the rayguns as she comes on cam.

 

The Scura is the focused sports bike of the garage residents

 

The MuZ is a big softie single. Fun and light for a back road rip.

Comfy, spacious and pratical.

 

Singles, V-Twins and Triples.......covered.

 

I never really gelled with fours.

 

Nige.

[g.forrest]

ahhh yes.my muz is sensible single power. but the cagiva is the buzz. v twin grin.

That is precisely why I have three bikes.

 

I like the soul of the Triumph Triple engine. Not hugeley powerful in the guise I have, but smooth, comfortable and a wonderful banshee wail through the rayguns as she comes on cam.

 

The Scura is the focused sports bike of the garage residents 

 

The MuZ is a big softie single. Fun and light for a back road rip.

Comfy, spacious and pratical.

 

Singles, V-Twins and Triples.......covered. 

 

I never really gelled with fours. 

 

Nige. 

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[Frenchbob]

I didn't realise how good my V11 actually is until recently suffering a puncture on a ride out: when I had stopped , I realised that I could attribute two lurid wobbles and several iffy moments to about 5psi in the rear tyre. I didn't come off and I stopped because it "felt funny" - the stability was still there, just.

 

I absolutely agree with the idea that a contrasting bike helps you appreciate better what you've got: riding my 500 single Armstrong enduro always makes me quicker on the V11 afterwards.

 

And, Nog, I concur with what Scooter said about his V11 gearbox: mine is sweet, too. I think yours must be suffering some sort of problem.

[Guest Nogbad]

Gave the V11 a good thrash out today, several 3 figure bursts and a very satisfying pass of a Honda something on the way into a bend. Outbraked him on the way in and out accelerated him on the way out. Road too twisty to give the greater power of the Jap bike a purchase.

 

Gearbox is fine until the engine temperature is soaked. Then it becomes sticky when hot. Maybe a swap to this Redline Heavy elixir is the answer. The gearbox is the same after the tranny recall work as before. No difference in shift action occurred at all.

 

I still think the Buell / Harley box is better, though I may get the clutch lightening kit fitted.

[Ballacraine]

I still think the Buell / Harley box is better, though I may get the clutch lightening kit fitted.

86933[/snapback]

 

 

Careful now!

 

I still get a nervous twitch when somebody mentions a lightened clutch!

 

Nige.

[Guest Nogbad]

Careful now! 

 

I still get a nervous twitch when somebody mentions a lightened clutch! 

 

Nige. 

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Nah, it isn't what you think. The kit is just a shallower thrust ramp so that the lever moves further for the same lift.

[Ballacraine]

Nah, it isn't what you think. The kit is just a shallower thrust ramp so that the lever moves further for the same lift.

86953[/snapback]

 

Would an adjustable lever help?

 

Nige.

[mark.gilmore]

Gave the V11 a good thrash out today, several 3 figure bursts and a very satisfying pass of a Honda something on the way into a bend. Outbraked him on the way in and out accelerated him on the way out. Road too twisty to give the greater power of the Jap bike a purchase.

 

Gearbox is fine until the engine temperature is soaked. Then it becomes sticky when hot. Maybe a swap to this Redline Heavy elixir is the answer. The gearbox is the same after the tranny recall work as before. No difference in shift action occurred at all.

 

I still think the Buell / Harley box is better, though I may get the clutch lightening kit fitted.

86933[/snapback]

 

 

Hay Nog

 

My box is exactly the same, may be the oil,I use full synthetic Fuchs. May change to Redline hd if I can get hold of some here down under.

cheers all,GILLY