Question for V11 Owners...

[Guest drhunt1]

...especially those that have ridden older LeMans Guzzis. I am the owner of a 1980 LeMans CX100, and throughly enjoy the bike. Yes, it's underpowered, but the bike is so compact, (long and low), the center of gravity is VERY low, and the bike handles beautifully. I'm considering adding another LeMans to the garage, but there are no local dealers that have demo bikes.

 

My question is...have any of you V11 owners owned a LeMans I or II before and can give me some feedback on comparing the new with the old?

[Frenchbob]

I didn't ever own a Mk 1 or 2 Lemon, but I have ridden them and owned other Guzzis. I currently have a 750 S3 as well as my V11. If you don't get any better offers, I can give you feedback: PM me.

[guzziownr]

Paging Mr. Blackkat, Mr. Blackkat to the red courtesy phone...

 

The fun part is riding them back to back on a twisty road. You don't realize how hard it is to get the early bikes to change direction until you ride the same route on a V11.

 

Apart from power, brakes and handling the V11 is no real improvement over the '70s models.

 

DW

[kaput]

...especially those that have ridden older LeMans Guzzis. I am the owner of a 1980 LeMans CX100, and throughly enjoy the bike. Yes, it's underpowered, but the bike is so compact, (long and low), the center of gravity is VERY low, and the bike handles beautifully. I'm considering adding another LeMans to the garage, but there are no local dealers that have demo bikes.

 

My question is...have any of you V11 owners owned a LeMans I or II before and can give me some feedback on comparing the new with the old?

 

 

Owned an MK4 which is similar to the CX. The biggest differences you will experience are faster engine response, more power, quicker steering and most pointedly - a quicker shifting mostly accurate gearbox. The engine will rev quicker, feel faster and more responsive, and will feel more sorted in the lower rpm range. Strangely it might also vibrate more at cruising speed but that can be fixed. The vibes in general are different in that the old one shakes like a wet dog until it becomes smooth once past 4 grand and the newer one shakes itself dry much quicker but in the process never quite manages to get rid of a higher frequency tingle that seems to vary in severety from bike to bike. It is not really bothersome it just feels different. The handling will be much quicker in that the V11 will fall into corners more readily but still feel stable like the old one (especially the later versions starting with the Le Mans). The V11 is generally much more agile and obviously benefits from newer suspension and tire technology. I always thought that my lemans was efficient in directing airflow but the newer one offers better protection. Still, all in all, you will immediately feel at home, you will know you are on a guzzi sportbike and will marvel at the progress made (for a guzzi). They are really much more similar than different. Both will make awesome noises with the proper aftermarket encouragement. Riding the two models back to back is a real treat.

 

 

Kaput

[Guest drhunt1]

Thank you all for your responses...they are all being carefully considered as I research the newer bikes. I suppose it will come down to my having actually riden a newer LeMans for me to be able to decide if the addition to my garage is the direction I want to go. My 1980 CX100 has had the flywheel lightened and balanced, which besides the addition of an electronic ignition was THE most important change. No more pulling to the right when blipping the throttle, and although I can't determine if it was contributory, the jack-shaft reaction has been reduced. Question...do the newer LeMans' have that same flywheel reaction?

 

There are always trade-offs, and more torque and hp equates to shorter rear tire life. The tiny rear tire on my CX100 actually is wearing pretty well...due to the fact that the bike produces only about 68 hp. One of the great things, IMHO, about the MKII and more so with the MKI, is how tiny the bike is overall...they're like pocketbikes, and people not familiar with these bikes are amazed that it's a 1000cc bike.

 

The 1200S has been released in Europe, and early reports are that it's a sweet bike with an awesome powerplant. But with it's minimalist fairing, it is no match visually to a V11 LeMans, which has to be one of THE prettiest bikes ever produced. I appreciate all the feedback...if there's anything else you can add...I'm all eyes and ears!

[Skeeve]

The 1200S has been released in Europe, and early reports are that it's a sweet bike with an awesome powerplant. But with it's minimalist fairing, it is no match visually to a V11 LeMans, which has to be one of THE prettiest bikes ever produced.

 

You are clearly an individual of great refinement and taste.

 

Ride safe!

[Baldini]

I've had a LM11 for 20yrs & a V11 Scura for 4. The Tonti has Marzocchi forks, Konis & RAM single plate clutch, 950 (flat top SP) pistons, open pipes. Wasn't interested in modern Guzzis til the Ohlins kitted Scura came available at low price. It just looked real nice, & I was tired of the harsh suspension on the Tonti.

First time I sat on a V11 made me smile cos it was just like the old Guzzi, more than anything else.

I'm happy with the Scura, it's a lovely bike to ride. First off it's far more comfortable than the Tonti, it's bigger & softer. It has more power which makes it more relaxing to ride tho imv with 6 speeds they could have given it a higher top gear. It's a fair stretch 2nd to 3rd too. But the gearbox works sweeter & faster than a 5 speed. Up changes w/o the clutch are v quick.

It is quicker turning than the Tonti but that doesn't mean a lot: it's still a big bike to get thru tight stuff with any grace. Also the fat rear tyre (180) means front turns in & then you wait for back to follow where 100f110r Tonti turns without that imbalance - both wheels going over at the same rate. You can ameliorate this by tyre choice. V11 frame is not as strong as Tonti. Tho it is pretty stable, it does not feel as planted or secure as a Tonti frame. Some of this is down to not being able to get your weight up over the front like you can on a Tonti cos the V11 tank comes back too far, therefore increasing the already rearward weight bias. But mostly IMV it just doesn't have the inherent stiffness of the Tonti. Nor is the spineframe the thing of beauty that the Tonti frame is. Torque reaction is less noticeable on the V11 but that never bothered me anyhow. Floating rear hub is better than Tonti cos there's no jacking up or down on the back. It uses tyres faster than a Tonti & the fat tyres are more fashion than function, tho it does give you access to the latest tyre designs & compounds (try a Michelin Pilot Power 2CT - Heh! heh!) where you're a bit stuck for choice on the Tonti.

Tho I was biased against it for fear of not knowing what to do with it the FI has been good for me - I got a shop to set it up & it's run great - I haven't a clue how it works tho. I do the Tonti carbs & can get it sweet by sound & feel which is nice but there's no question it's more farting around. Same w/ points ignition. But the thing with the Tonti fuel/ignition is it's simple, I can fix it with a spanner & a screwdriver.

Not sure that build quality or materials of basic parts (frame/motor) are as good on the V11 compared with a Tonti. Alloy used is apparently not up to exposure to the elements which is why they paint em whereas 30yr old bare alu Tonti motor will still brush up tidy.

Brakes on V11 are better, w/ much better feel but then Tonti brakes are pretty damn good.

 

Depends what you want. I love my old Tontis but I wouldn't sell the Scura now! The newer bikes are closly related to the old in looks, sound & feel - more so than you might expect. I'd pick the Scura to ride most times cos it's simply easier; roomier, comfier & more power & I'm getting on a bit now - the Tonti is harder work but it's more compact & predictable, feels lighter, tighter & more manageable when pushing on & easier to move around on. Dunno which would be faster down a twisty road tho.

 

KB

[Guest drhunt1]

Baldini-thank you VERY much for that excellent synopsis...you're right on the money as far as the tonti framed Guzzi goes...it's a very stiff, but stable ride. I've also noticed the "weight forward" attitude of the CX100...front tire wear is noticeable on the Pirelli Sport Demons...which is due to the 'eveness' of weight distribution.

 

How is your Scura for long distance sport touring...400 miles+/day?

 

I am a sucker for motorcycles that have nice body work, and the fiberglass lowers and Spada fairing not only offer functionality, they simply knock me out visually. Looks like I'm going to have to take a drive to the Bay Area and test drive a newer LeMans, or wait for the 1200S and put an aftermarket magni fairing on it.

[Guest Nogbad]

 

Apart from power, brakes and handling the V11 is no real improvement over the '70s models.

 

DW

 

Er? It's a motorcycle! What else is there other than power, brakes and handling?

[Frenchbob]

Er? It's a motorcycle! What else is there other than power, brakes and handling?

 

Don't agree, Nog.

 

Comfort?

Practicality?

Ergonomics?

Character?

Tuneability?

Reliability?

Build quality?

 

 

 

If it were just power, brakes and handling we would all have some sort of Yamaha crotch rocket, surely?

[Guest Nogbad]

Don't agree, Nog.

 

Comfort?

Practicality?

Ergonomics?

Character?

Tuneability?

Reliability?

Build quality?

If it were just power, brakes and handling we would all have some sort of Yamaha crotch rocket, surely?

 

Hair splitter!

[Guest drhunt1]

Comfort?

Practicality?

Ergonomics?

Character?

Tuneability?

Reliability?

Build quality?

If it were just power, brakes and handling we would all have some sort of Yamaha crotch rocket, surely?

 

 

I have owned a couple of jap bikes, 2 BMW's, a Norton Commando Interstate and now have my third bevel drive Ducati besides the CX100 Moto Guzzi...which is the second time I've owned one of these. The only bike I ever really regret selling was the Guzzi. Why? Because the bike has a soul...a life of it's own. Ducatis are similar...but jap bikes and BMW's? Nah.

 

I'm never going to take my bike on the track...so I want useable power, brakes and suspension for real world situations. Starting in the Spring, and extending through the Fall, I ride in the Sierra Nevada mountains and foothills mostly...Tioga, Sonora, Ebbetts and Monitor Pass, plus rides through old gold country on Hiway 49. Most of the time, the roads are smooth and well maintained, so I don't notice the stiffness of the suspension. And as long as I am smooth in my shifts, anticipate the road and gear well, then the bikes' performance is pretty adequate. But...the grass always seems greener....and I have an itch to ride a newer Guzzi to see if a major improvement can be made...one that is real time, street noticeable and worth the money.

[jrt]

I've had or have a couple of Loopframes, a couple of Tonti frames and a short-frame Spine frame...so I've ridden a few Guzzi's. All of them have their charms. The Tonti is a great carving machine for long, wide sweepers. I really like the inherent stability of that design. It's also a joy on the highway as it can drone on at speed and just seems to be loping along. The ergonomics are the better than the newer bikes.

The Sport just seems more brutal to me. Not in a bad way, but the power delivery is far more immediate, much more torquey. The Sport falls into corners faster and brakes much better. Just the seating stance alone is more aggressive (and cramped), so that with everything else, it lends itself to hooliganism (as much as a Guzzi can). I open the throttle a lot more...somewhat just to hear it, but also it feels GREAT! It is undoubtedly much more refined from an engineering standpoint.

In my , the Tonti and the Sport compliment each other, but they don't do the same job. For the style of riding you're describing, the Sport (or LeMans) would be ideal. That's not to take anything away from the CX100- I would love to ride those roads again on either bike. Hell, I'd love to ride those again on ANY bike.

Fly out to St. Louis, I'll let you take my Sport out into the Ozarks and you can see, and decide, for yourself.

[mg spd rcr]

I have owned a CX100 an SPII that I made look like a CX100. Presently I have 3 Tonti's and 1 spine frame. I liked my old Tonti's they were very fun to ride but as I rode newer versions the older bikes showed their age. I know a lot of guys won't agree with me but the best Tonti made to date is the FI California series and I know they don't look like sport bikes but with minor to moderate changes they become very good sport bikes. plus with few modifications you could hang entire CX100 bodywork onto the Cali bike and also have the look of a sportbike. the next paragraph you didn't ask for this info but I'm throwing it out so you may understand why I feel hanging onto the earlier versions is only for the collectors the newer versions are much better equipped and more fun to ride swiftly. the older bikes require you to work harder for similiar speed, for some this is more fun...not for me.

 

when they (FI California's) came out I refused to even look at them I felt they missed the mark they couldn't be better than my modified SP for crying out loud they were now cruisers...then I rode RacerX's Jackal (Todd Eagan's HOT ROD Jackal) at buttonwillow Raceway and I was passing sportbikes at will in B group (riding at about 7/10ths) within a month I sold my bike that I swore I would never sell to get a Jackal to make into a sportbike. I have not regreted it at all. I have changed the bars, front fork springs (wilbers progressive), relaced front rim to a 17X3.5, bought rearset footcontrols, and raised the seat, added second front brake and steelbraided lines with 19mm radial mastercylinder, and have ordered Wilbers rearshocks. I have kept the bodywork stock it is more fun that way with the sportbike crowd ( they hate it!) Todds Jackal has been the absolute best Tonti I have got to ride to date. my version is a close second ( Todd has changed alot more stuff that make it better)this is the bike I like riding the most. my spine frame (Scura) I like the looks of this bike the most and is my 2nd favorite bike to ride (very close second, well almost equal)

 

sooo as everyone has told you the old bike's feel really small, newer bikes are bigger and weigh more but feel lighter when you are moving...very true. in the end I think the newer versions are going to win you over...old bikes are like x-girlfiends at a time of "weakness" you remember them fondly but a few moments later you KNOW why they are no longer around and are happy with your choices. richr

[GuzziHutch]

I'm the fortunate owner of a very well sorted (by previous owner) '84 LMIII as well as well sorted '03 Lemans. Maybe that's closes enough to respond to your question.

 

The Lemans III has had a significant number of upgrades done to improve reliability and power. With only 50,000 miles on the clock it has no issues and I would ride it across county tomorrow. Ditto the V11 (12,000 miles).

 

I’ll respond to your question from a rider’s perspective. When I get on the older bike, I’ll swear it is just like TIME TRAVELLING. The sounds, the vibration, the feel puts me back in the ‘60s (minus the acid, of course). It’s really a wonderful indescribable experience and it keeps me loving and owning that bike. The power on the bottom end and the mid range almost rival the V11, but the V11 has longer legs up top. The integration of sound and vibration on the LMIII really speaks my language. Now these are two very soulful bikes, but if pressed to answer, the LMIII has more soul. Maybe it’s a mellowing with age thing.

 

But I also love the V11. It obviously more modern, sits slightly higher and will carry more stuff so it is superior for multiple day trips. And who can deny that LOOK. Awesome!